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Post by simtech on Oct 29, 2018 2:42:02 GMT
I've been spoiled with the DC-10 and L1011 where I have been able to glance and see the spoilers deploy on rollout. I have been unable to do so with the DC-8. I saw in the panel (v. INS) that there's a spoiler ext. gauge, but looking at the size, 12 X 14, I suspect it's a hidden gauge. Is this true? Just curious... Flies very well in FSX-A with all supported systems. Thank you for the clarification...Terry
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Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Oct 29, 2018 14:17:01 GMT
As per the DC-8 manual .... DC-8 PANEL MANUALtonymadgehjg.proboards.com/thread/8019/hjg-panel-installation-handling-notesAll DC-8 panel CP sub panels are identical and therefore function identically .... although perhaps fundamentally diffeently fom what you may be more accustomed to in regard to the DC-10 and L-1011 panel Spoler Lever functions .... The Spoiler Lever (handle) is located on each CP sub panel .... to the upper right of the thrust levers and left of the flap lever handle .... One has 3 options available in order to deploy the Spoilers .... 1. Mouse Click and drag the Spoiler handle to the "ARMED" position .... this is the recommended procedure .... and which will enable the wing spoilers to auto-deploy upon ground coctact. 2. Select keyboasrd commands SHIFT+BACKSLASH keyboard commands .... this action should auto-arm the spoilers to enable their auto-deployment upon ground conctact. 3. Select the BACK-SLASH (standard FS wing spoiler deployment keyboard command) upon landing All 3 procedures work fine .... "DO NOT" .... under any circumstances .... extend the wing Spoilers inflight. The wing Spoilers on all DC-8 aircraft (although not wired to prevent inflight use) are restricted for ground deployment only. History records at least 2 particular nasty accidents that occurred as the result of inadvertant inflight spoiler deployments .... such as the following example which occurred during 1970 .... ACCDENT REPORT aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19700705-0CVR TRANSCRIPT aviation-safety.net/investigation/cvr/transcripts/cvr_ac621.phpMark C BOG/CO
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Post by simtech on Oct 29, 2018 17:52:22 GMT
Mark, thank you for the quick response. I was aware as to "how to" deploy the spoilers, however, I was hoping for some indicator designating that they had deployed. Evidently the "spoiler extension gauge" in the panel.cfg is an "invisible gauge" used for other purposes. Perhaps if I do more careful flight planning, I would arrive on the runway without the need for spoilers...lol... Terry
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Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Oct 29, 2018 19:17:42 GMT
There "IS" an indicator lamp to alert one to the fact the wing spoilers have "physically deployed".
At the top middle of each Main Panel .... below the windshield .... and below the yellow Pneumatic Brake tab .... and to the right of the RAT guage .... there´s a bank of 2 lamps.
The left Lamp (yellow) is the Anti-Skid infdicator lamp and which illmuminates whenever the Anti-Skid switch is engaged.
The right lamp (blue) is the Wing Spoilers Deployed lamp and which illuminates only when the wing spoilers have been "physically deployed" upon landing.
Unlike is the case with our DC-10 and L-1011 panels .... the DC-8 doesn´t have a lamp to indicate/annunciate Wing Spoilers arming.
Mark C BOG/Co
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Post by simtech on Oct 30, 2018 3:47:38 GMT
WOW! Thank you, Mark.. I looked into that area, but unfortunately neither indicator had a "tool tip" and I missed that the first time. I see that the anti-skid does illuminate, however; the "blue" indicator never comes on, regardless of the spoiler position. wonder if I'm missing a .bmp? I'll keep looking... Thank you for the clue.... I went to the panel folder and looked at the main panel .bmp and sure enough, after enlarging it, it says "Spoilers Extended". However, it never changes states. Well, since it's in the DC8sw gauge and not a .cab file.. I really can't tell if the .bmp is there or not... It was a thought anyway... Thanks for following up...
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Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Oct 30, 2018 12:14:32 GMT
The Spoiler lamp does not illuminate in respmse to the Spolier Lever being armed .... itd´not intended to. The Spoiler lamp only iluminates when the wing spoilers have successfully depoloyed "after" landing .... once the landing geat has been compressed sufficienly in order the trigger the Spolier Lever from is "ARM" to "SPOLIERS EXTENDED" detent. I´ll try´n post images later .... if I have time to do so Mark C BOG/CO
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Post by Herman on Oct 30, 2018 13:32:49 GMT
Also simtech, please note that as far as I know, deployment of wing spoilers upon landing is always required regardless of your flight planning.
Herman
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Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Oct 30, 2018 14:41:00 GMT
Just a few illstatrations Terry.... showing the DC-8 panels Anti-Skid, Spoiler Arm, Spoiler Deployed, and Reverser Lights features in use .... as they each work/should all be seen to work in both FS versions .... Approach to landing .... Spoiler Lever "armed" .... Anti-Skid "off" (note Spoiler Lever handle is set to "ARM" and with no lamp illumiation .... and Anti-Skid lamp is also extinguished). Approach to landing .... Spoiler Lever "armed" .... Anti-Skid "armed" (note Spoiler Lever handle is set to "ARM" and with no lamp illumination .... but yellow Anti-Skid lamp is now illuminated). Touchdown (bit of cross wind component evident here ) .... Spoiler Lever "auto-deployed" .... Anti-Skid "armed" (note blue Spoiler lamp is now illuminated .... as well as yellow Anti-Skid lamp also). Touchdown and derotation .... wing spoilers fully auto-deployed. Rollout after landing (cross wind influence more-or-less "kicked-off" ) .... Spoiler Lever "auto-deployed" .... Anti-Skid "armed" .... reverse thrust manually engaged (note blue Spoiler lamp is illuminated .... yellow Anti-Skid lamp illuminated also .... along with orange engine thrust reverser engaged lamps illuminated too). "THIS" is how these features each work .... and should all be seen to function in both FS versions. These features each work identically in all of our DC-8 panels. Mark C BOG/CO
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Post by simtech on Oct 30, 2018 19:15:19 GMT
Herman, you're absolutely correct IRT getting the wing to stop flying as soon as possible. I use them religiously... However: Mark, your pictures are grand and I understand completely.. My panel, control surfaces and reversers look just like your pictures....with the exception that the blue light never illuminates. I tried a couple of landings thinking the light was tied to the nose wheel scissor switch and touched the brakes to ensure the nw was compressed.. I subsequently concluded that the spoilers deploy by the squat switch on the mains. The spoilers did, in fact deploy, however the light never came on..reverser lights illuminated and so does the anti-skid. No biggie... just an observation. Not sure why my installation doesn't want to play by the "rules". Thank you for your thorough reply and clarification. I have the "plain" panel without the INS. I'll see if that makes a difference.
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Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Oct 30, 2018 19:54:32 GMT
The DC-8 panel version won´t/shouldn´t make any difference in regard to the way these features (those discussed within this thread) work .... BUT .... I am curious as to why your Spooler Lamp isn´t illuminating when the Spoilers deploy .... because this should be a standard indication whether or not the wing spoilers are armed or manually deployed upon landing. I´ll ask George to have a look at this .... if he doesn´t read this first Mark C BOG/CO
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Post by simtech on Oct 30, 2018 20:00:16 GMT
Mark, thank you for being interested. Just completed a couple of landings with the "plain" panel... and as you suspected.. didn't make any difference. I thought perhaps I might have had a corrupted DC8sw gauge. Looks like there's something else... hmmmmm.. I enjoy the plane anyway, it's just a quirk I noticed.. Thank you again..
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Post by Herman on Oct 31, 2018 13:02:45 GMT
OK simtech....my reason for responding was due to your statement in one of your posts above....and I quote ( perhaps if I do more carefull flight planning I would arrive at the runway without having to use the spoilers ).
Could your problem of not getting the Spoiler lamp indication be related to your FSX system.
I use FSX Steam but am unable to use my computer for testing as we are away from home at the present time.
Cheers; Herman
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Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Oct 31, 2018 13:57:06 GMT
It´s "not" his system .... and it´s "not" his installation either.
This item (the blue "Spoilers Deployed" lamp .... and this issue may also extend to the yellw "Auto Brakes Armed" lamp also) is "definitely not working "in FSX" and as is supported by video evidence on this forum.
All is fine in FS2004 though (FS9 installetions "ARE NOT" implicated).
The related animations are functioning perefectly in both FS versions .... it´s just the annunciator lamps that aren´t working "in FSX only".
The issue has been reported internally.
Mark C BOG/CO
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Post by simtech on Oct 31, 2018 19:29:21 GMT
Thank you, Mark.. Yes.. the animations work fine.. only the indication is at fault. For awhile I thought I was venturing into Looney Tune Towne. I haven't checked "Auto Brake Armed" as I rarely use that feature. I can if you wish. (Try to save the brake pads). Seriously, thank you for the update and explanation. It is just an inconsistency that I had noticed. I checked for the Auto Brake Armed indicator and I don't seem to have it on the DC-8-50 or on the DC-9-40. The AB control is there, but couldn't find the indicator. I realize that HJG doesn't have FSX native panels for the DC-9 so I can't speak to your panels. I had to resort to "an imposter", but it works. The DC-10 also has AB and it functions as expected on T/O, however, the Auto Brake indicator in the overhead does not light when AB function is initiated. But in HJG's infinite wisdom, you knew that already. No biggie... I'm just glad I wasn't drifting into the Twilight Zone. Thank you all for checking this out and confirming, I'm not gone yet.. Terry
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Post by George Carty - HJG on Oct 31, 2018 19:44:59 GMT
That yellow light isn't an "Auto Brake Armed" light, it's an "Anti Skid Inop" light – you can turn it off by turning the Anti-Skid system on (using the switch on the glareshield).
George
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