KC-135A Takeoff Procedures

[Jordan Claus]

Ok, it's obvious that the J57 "A" models are underpowered. Personally I think that's what makes them cool, they're heavy and underpowered which makes every takeoff gutwrenching. My question is, is there a procedure that will emulate water injection into the J57's? The base package didn't come with much documentation about procedures. I've managed a takeoff with full flaps but the warning alarm is constantly ringing in my ear and it's annoying as hell. Anyone know of any "A" model takeoff procedures that work well in FS9?

[aerofoto - HJG Admin]

Only our B707-120 panel has "water injection" .... see "BOEING PANELS" page

You'll also need the "B707 HEAVY SMOKE EFFECTS" file too .... see "EFFECTS" page.

I don't know how our B707-120 panel will run with our KC135-A models.

If you try it I recommend you replace the KC135-A AIRCRAFT.CFG file and AIR.FILE for that of our B707-120 .... or .... it's likely the panel won't perform properly.

The above recommended configuration should work fine. You most certainly can't do any harm trying this

BTW .... early KC135-A aircraft (like their early B707-120 counterparts) were "underpowered". A fully laden or overloaded aircraft requiring some 12.500-13,700 feet of runway to safely get airborne. From contempory descritions .... take-off was a long, slow, noisy, extremly dirty, and sometimes "gut wrenching" (as you put it) affair.

Mark C
AKL/NZ

[louross]

Yeh, but "full flaps" would not be used on takeoff.

[christrott]

Yes they would.

Full flaps were used as part of the normal heavyweight takeoff procedure on the KC-135A, and is still normal for several of the re-engined models of the C-135.

[Jordan Claus]

Gotta agree w/ chris, I know a retired 707 pilot (he was my FAA examiner) who told me stories about how they would run up a fully laden 707 at the end of the runway for fifteen or twenty [seconds] before takeoff and they used full flaps quite a bit. Good Times ;D

[jimhalinda]

... please tell us you meant 15 or 20 seconds!!!

Jim

[Jordan Claus]

Sorry about that, yes it was fifteen to twenty SECONDS, my bad.

~Jay~

[Jordan Claus]

Mark, the panel, cfg, and air file swap isn't working for some reason. Oh well, no biggy...full flaps work just fine on the takeoff roll. As long as you got a good 7,000 feet there is no problem what so ever. Just thought I could dirty up the place a bit more. Oh and for everyone else who might venture into this thread visit www.rc135.com. I swear to God it's worth the read; any true aviation buff would be in tears by the time they finish.

Rest in Peace
Boozer, 31 December 1968
59-1491 "Rivet Ball," 13 January 1969
62-4137 "Rivet Amber," 15 April 1969

[aerofoto - HJG Admin]

Mark, the panel, cfg, and air file swap isn't working for some reason.

To what extent is it not working ?

Do you mean not displaying in FS .... or what ?

There's no reason why it shouldn't work .... so long as you've got all the [fltsim.X] data on the B707-120 AIRCRAFT.CFG adjusted correctly to represent your KC135-A.

That should all work fine !

Mark C
AKL/NZ

[louross]

Okay, I stand corrected!

[Jordan Claus]

It's ok Lou, I was corrected too... oh and Mark, the panel and everything shows up fine. It's just when I run up the engines and kick in the water injection the program goes awol on me (most of the time the program just freezes and trust me it's not a hardware issue. Oh and there is a little bit of a problem when I lower the flaps. The flaps drop to 100% but it doesn't show on the flap gauge for some reason.

~Jay~

BTW. just so I don't forget, the 707 "heavy smoke" isn't showing for some reason or other.

[christrott]

Guys,

DO NOT swap out the whole AIR File. I can't stress enough that the 707 and KC-135 are not the same aircraft.

What you need to do is just ensure that the proper entries in the KC-135 CFG have been modified to work with the panel. Just go through the 707-120 CFG and look for any lines in the "engine" and "smoke" sections (there's 2 or 3 engine sections, and 1 "smoke") that are missing in the KC-135 and add them in. Any other modifications aren't required for the panel to work right.

[Jordan Claus]

Now why didn't I think of that
You know chris couldn't be more true about the 707 and 135 being two different aircraft. Sure they share the same roots but the one thirty five is a bit fatter than her sexy sister. Then again most of you already knew that

[aerofoto - HJG Admin]

Any other modifications aren't required for the panel to work right.

I'm not sure (only George CARTY could confirm this), but, incompatibility may arise with the KC135-A AIRCRAFT.CFG file in relation to fuel on the CARTY panel. This could see engines not starting or otherwise crapping-out.

My suggestion to use the B707-120 AIRCRAFT.CFG file was only a "dirty fix" to get around this potential problem.

I appreciate of course that in reality KC135 series aircraft and B707's have little in common with each other.

I've no idea if Geoorge is planning any specific panel and FDE modifications for the 135's, but, it has been suggested to him.

Mark C
AKL/NZ

[Jordan Claus]

Well I dunno about fuel but I'm still having problems with the flap gauge. Like I said earlier though it's no big deal 'cause even without the 707 mod the takeoff is dirty as hell. ;D If anyone else wants to continue to try and fix these little kinks within the mod's more too ya. Personally the one thirty five is great as is. An update to the 135 effects for water/alchohol injection would be nice as well as a series of 135 panels. In the meantime the 120B panel works just fine for "A" models and for anything later I would suggest the 320.

~Jay~

Oh and just for fun, try a takeoff from Shemya, Alaska (known as the "Rock" to SAC RC-135 crews). If that isn't challenge enough do it in IFR conditions like the SAC crews used to do it, it's such a rush!!!