That day a B 727-200 ADV XA-MEM operating flight MX 940 crashed after a tire explosión and following inflight fire making uncontrolable the aircraft. The overheated brake could not be identified in the take off run as at that time there were no temperature sensors in the wheel wells. All 166 persons onboard died, thus beeing the worst accident of Mexican aviation and also the worst of all B 727 s.
The higly experienced crew under Captain Carlos Guadarrama Sistos did notice the prolonged take off run but had no way to know that a brake was sticking. They tried to go back to MMMX and still demanded fire engines to assist their landing. But the fire had already destroyed the hydraulic and electric systems of the airplane.
Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Apr 5, 2020 11:40:05 GMT
Sounds similar to what happened to the NATIONAIR DV-8-61 charter at Jeddah back in 1981 .... although I understand the cause of that accident was attributed to an under-ptressured tire (or tires) and pro-longed taxiing to the RWY during extremely high ambient temperatures.
Jet aviation had many years accidents coming from the wheels. Only to name a few: Swissair 306 which led to non flamable hydraulic fluids, Nigeria Airways Flt 2120 is also one, doomed also by fire in the wheel well and no SOP available for gear problems around V1. Similar also happened to a DC 10 of SPANTAX flight 995, the pilots decided to fly after V1 but before reaching VR vibrations got so worse, the pilots aborted to avoid control loss being airborne, but could not bring the airplane to a standstill on the runway. The airplane crashed into some construction at the runway end. Out of 394 on board 344 did survive. The vibrations were caused by a blown tire on the front wheel bogie. The investigation report cleared the pilots from guilt, as the pilot training of that time did not contain SOP for wheel failures. In the recomendations there is also a point we have discussed here before by demanding that unnecessary low flap settings (8 deg in case) should be avoided and the airlines should establish the most convinient settings. In this case would have been 18 deg the optimum setting reducing the speeds nearly 20 kts. The airplane would not have stopped also on the runway, but the demage by the buildings could have been less.
Post by mobianstoryteller on Apr 6, 2020 7:43:11 GMT
According to the Air Crash Investigation/Mayday episode on the Nationair crash, the accident DC-8 had taken off and landed 7 times in the time before the crash with the underinflated tires. The extra weight on the Haji flight might have made a difference, though honestly it was the project manager not realizing the consequences of not topping up the tires.
Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Apr 6, 2020 20:01:50 GMT
many passangers tried to take their hand lugage with them
I think one's only got to observe the aisle congestion that's evident on most civil aircraft during normal boarding and disembarkation .... albeit that only 1 or 2 doors (at the very most) are used for either .... THEN .... using one's imagination "try to" visualise the same scene in the case of a damaged, probably burning, aircraft with smoke infiltrating its cabin .... and mostly panic-stricken (and in some cases probably injured) PAX too all wanting to "get off quick and with what they got on with" (at the expense of other peoples security or lives of course) even when most exits are probably open. One might then be able to realize why the outcome "is" the way it "is" in the case of most emergency evacuations .... with the exception of the very luckiest of these situations .... like occurred at YYZ in the case of the AF overrun where "EVERYONE" got off, albeit with some minor injuries, and despite the fact that many got off with what they got on with too.
People .... in some cases .... simply "DO NOT" think .... but then again .... many, in emergency situations, are in no fit emotional state to be able to think logically anyway to jungle law (everyone pushing, and shoving, and climbing over everyone and everything else) becomes "the method for the moment" for one's own survival.
To many .... their possessions appear to be equal to, if not more important than, their own (or other peoples) lives .... because they simply "DO NOT UNDERSTAND" .... let alone "THINK"
Think also there is a problem, that the paxes are not trained for any emergency onboard an airplane. The often overheard annouces before take off (oxygen masks, emergency exits) are no help. And if fire and smoke enters the cabin the passangers fall back to their instincts, which are apt to live in open plains and not in a tube crammed together resembling a sea of faces.
Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Apr 8, 2020 20:50:37 GMT
paxes are not trained for any emergency onboard an airplane. The often overheard annouces before take off (oxygen masks, emergency exits) are no help. And if fire and smoke enters the cabin the passangers fall back to their instincts, which are apt to live in open plains and not in a tube crammed together resembling a sea of faces.
The problem (or part of it) Walter there's limits to how far any safety demonstration can go .... and what's presented is generally "reserved" in regard to its content. The slightest mention of "fire and smoke" potentially scares the crap out of PAX .... most of whom are probably already as nervous as hell anyway .... and most airlines do care enough about their clientele to avoid frightening the nuts out them because they want to encourage their business again in the future.
As for PAX training .... if one flies very frequently each year then probably consider oneself "reasonably well trained" .... but .... a part of good training is also frequent refresher course too and of the type that require no more than 5 minutes of anyone's attention .... like paying attention to the briefing as well as reading the safety card.
Even when I fly twice, or more, during the same day (and which does happen to me every so often) I routinely read that safety card on ever flighht I board .... and additionally pay full attention to the briefing too .... and that's no matter how many times I've seen the same briefing or read the same card previously .... but then again .... I do tend to be a very procedurally inclined as well as organized person
My feeling is .... if it's good enough for flight deck crews to perform the very same technical/procedural checks on each flight, day in, and day out, then there's no reason why I shouldn't do the same in regard to both refamiliarising myself with the safety card and paying attention to the safety briefing .... expecially considering my life might, and someone elses's too, might depend on it.
Having walked away from one accident (years ago) .... and which was no more than a "nasty fright" really .... my attitude may be different to most/have been conditioned in the sense that, as a natural pessimist but always one with with a stripe of optimism too (and which is about as bi-poar as I'll ever get) I realize it/an accident "CAN" happen .... any time .... and with little or no warning .... so .... be prepared .... and above all be ready to act immediately if necessary.
The average PAX simply can't really be trained .... given that flying for most is probably a once (or twice) in every 3 or 5 years event .... and usually regarded by many as something akin to a bus trip.
My best advice "to everyone" is .... no matter how many times you fly .... just "pay attention" to the bloody safety briefing and "read" the bloody safety card too. It only requires 5 minutes, or so, of your time .... and surely your life, as well as the lives of others around you too, are worth "just 5 minutes of concentration/attention"
At AIR NEW ZEALAND we, for years, have been puzzling/trying to find innovative ways to try'n capture peoples attention .... particularly in regard to the like of safety brifings. Here's a few of our past attempts ....
For this one we/the airline actually consulted families of the Erebus Disaster deceased for their authorization .... and for which more than 90% were consenting in favour of the airline .... www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZqbexjPU1c
Here's one of our original and more mundane safety demonstrations (for the B737-300 when we had them .... all gone now though) before we attempted the like of "something different" as is evidenced by the above .... www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-Mq9HAE62Y
And here's the "BLOOPERS" version of the same above cut .... since not everything went right even whilst making the above video concerning what to do when things go wrong www.youtube.com/watch?v=oavyisZHyCs
There's other "more personal" ways in which to get peoples attention too .... and above all to relax PAX in particular as per these actual SOUTHWEST, FRONTIER, and WESTJET on-board saftey demo's ....
Thanks for the links, there were so many creative spirits trying to help to get attention for basic things which can at a certain moment save your life. I myself since becoming a real pilot (PPL only) try to be shure before take off, where are the nearest emerg. exits, what direction to turn, where should be my oxzgen mask and my life vest?. Study the safety card and try to figure out, where all the useful things actualy are in real. Then relax and figure out what the guys up front are actually doing and enjoy the wonderful moment of parting ground and FLYING!
In that sense also HAPPY EASTER and avoid being cought by CORONA. What wonderful time it was, when CORONA was only a MEXICAN BEER!
Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Apr 10, 2020 19:21:17 GMT
No worries Walter .... some people here (not me at the moment though ) are using CORONA to combat CORONA ....
I read that production has been "temporarily suspended" as the result of lock downs during this global pandemic, so, depending how thirsty one is, supplies might dwindle "a bit" in some paces around the world (therefore stock up now) .... until we can all get through this current crisis and all be able drink normally once again .... "the crisis within this crisis" I s'pose some might say .... and more-so too given there no bloody way I'd ever risk drinking the water in some parts of the world
The beer .... and other means of hydration .... is probably a better, and far safer, bet