|
|
Post by elliott on Dec 22, 2010 18:04:59 GMT
Dear all,
i am lookng for help regarding INS intallation on Boeing 720. Did anyone make this?
Elliott
|
|
|
|
Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Dec 22, 2010 18:21:18 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by George Carty - HJG on Dec 22, 2010 20:25:20 GMT
The Boeing 720 has no INS, although the 720B does if you use the 1965-era panel.
George
|
|
|
|
Post by Dan K. Hansen on Mar 15, 2011 12:23:11 GMT
What was the tools used for navigation on the 720 then?
|
|
|
|
Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Mar 15, 2011 20:57:50 GMT
Mostly VOR to VOR Dan !
"SOME" B720-B's .... though "very few of them" .... were, apparently equipped with INS much later on .... as I understand was the case in respect of those aircraft operated by AEROCONDOR COLOMBIA .... which flew across the Caribbean from both Bogota and Medellin to Miami.
Mark C
AKL/NZ
|
|
|
|
Post by Dan K. Hansen on Mar 15, 2011 21:38:34 GMT
and crossing the Atlantic ocean how did they do that? there was no VOR's out there...?
|
|
|
|
Post by hitperson on Mar 15, 2011 22:27:18 GMT
and crossing the Atlantic ocean how did they do that? there was no VOR's out there...? close your eyes, point it in a direction and hope?? |
|
|
|
Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on Mar 16, 2011 2:17:28 GMT
I don't think many .... if any .... B720's crossed the Atlantic (except of ferry/delivery flights) .... in fact unlike the B707's I'm sure no B720's ever crossed the Atlantic routinely.
Remember .... B720's are short to medium range aircraft only.
Unless they were flying empty, but with additional tanking, I very much doubt they would have the range to get across the Atlantic without a couple of en-route stops .... Gander, Keflavik, and Shannon being the most commonly used tech-stops for transatlantic air services during the late 1950's and early 1960's.
Another thing too ....
Like DC8's, most B707's/B720's would probably have been equipped with Dual Doppler navigation systems during the late 1960's and 1970's rather than INS .... so .... our/HJG's inclusion of INS among our 1965 vintage B707 panel series is really just for "convenience" only. My own comments (above) in respect of INS and AEROCONDOR are similarly our of place too .... when, once again, Dual Doppler would have been the more appropriate comment.
I know for a fact AIR NEW ZEALAND DC8-52's were navigated using Dual Doppler systems and flew transpacific services from Auckland to Los Angles via Tahiti, Pago Pago, and Honolulu throughout the late 1960's and 1970's.
So far as I'm aware .... INS didn't begin to enter airline use until the very late 1960's .... or early 1970's .... and even then it was used on B747, DC10, and L1011 aircraft principally.
Therefore .... I admit equipping our HJG B707/720 panels with INS "isn't strictly authentic" .... BUT .... it does, at least, provide a very nice means by which to navigate these simulations over lengthy virtual overwater stretches within FS.
Prior to the introduction of both Dual Doppler and later INS air navigation systems .... and in the absence of VOR facilities too .... as was the case with transatlantic and transpacific crossings .... aviation navigation relied pretty intently upon both "dead reckoning" and "celestial referencing" in order to determine ones whereabouts above an otherwise featureless ocean (those eyebrow windows above the main flightdeck windows on B707's and DC8's is where the Sextant equipment (mostly portable) was located). For this reason early transatlantic jetliners also carried a navigator among their flight crew.
Mark C
AKL/NZ
|
|
|
|
Post by Dan K. Hansen on Mar 16, 2011 7:36:14 GMT
Or the ONS perhaps? Which was pre-INS. I know that the L1011's had both ONS and INS installed at least the first ones. But up until now, no-one has made a usable ONS for FS...
(Hmm... makes me thinking thoughts ....)
|
|
|
|
Post by louross on May 3, 2011 17:46:49 GMT
Me Pa, bless his ole heart, I guess, flew honkers for a biggy (like U_ _ _ _d). As memory serves (and at times it doesn't, anymore), he began studying celestial navigation in about 1955, or, was it 56?, in order to fly across the big blue one (the Pacific). However, first I ever heard of INS was on the 747 when it first came out in, uhmmm, really don't remember. '71? '69? '68?
lr.
|
|
|
|
Post by louross on May 3, 2011 17:54:34 GMT
Oh,
Sorry, but one other very pertinent point. He never said much about the 720 ( he said a lot about other a/c), but I seemed to pick up that the 720 paid less than the DC-8.
lr.
(this info provided due to the "your right to know" law.
|
|
|
|
Post by botamern on May 3, 2011 18:27:46 GMT
I don't think many .... if any .... B720's crossed the Atlantic (except of ferry/delivery flights) .... in fact unlike the B707's I'm sure no B720's ever crossed the Atlantic routinely. Aer Lingus would be a notable exception to that. Their three 720s plied the skies on DUB-SNN-JFK and DUB-SNN-BOS-JFK. They even provided notable leases to El Al for flights between London and Tel Aviv and even to Pakistan International for flights between Karachi and London. |
|
|
|
Post by aerofoto - HJG Admin on May 3, 2011 21:08:41 GMT
Might have something to do with the fact the UA may have used their B720´s on short domestic sectors .... unlike the DC8´s which flew further afield. "INTERSTING" Nick !  Something even I didn´t know about !  Mark C BOG/COL |
|
|
|
Post by walterleo on May 8, 2011 12:45:54 GMT
Hi: B 720 Braniff: Braniff used the 720 on their flights to Mexico and further south. Cap Len Morgan a distinguished writer in FLYING Magazine was Cap. on the 720 for some time. He described his first real T.O. from Mexico City (2300 m high) in the 720 Braniff (grossly underpowered): When we taxied out bystanders assembled to watch. I asked my very experienced copilot if somebody with a problem was coming in. No Sir he replied. Somebody with a problem is going out:we. I advice to stay on the brakes still full power is being reached. Hi did not report navigation problems over the Gulf of Mexico, where you are out of reach of the VOR´s for some time. But then it was normal procedure to fly the last heading after loosing the signal till receiving the new one. Besides ATC didn't have a radar reaching so far to complain. But what Morgan wrote, that then the ground-mapping mode of the weather radar was a great help in overwaternavigation, the radar had a wider range than the VOR´s and then they knew also to navigate with NDB´s and how to calculate the distance to a NDB. And not forget: LORAN was in use then also. Kind regards Walter |
|
